For Nepal's poor and powerless, it is either a dream-cracy or demon-cracy.

-Dr. Padam Lal Devkota, T.U

Doctor Padam Lal Devkota hails from Western part of this Himalayan Kingdom. He is modest but yet highly qualified. Currently Dr. Devkota is associated with the Central Department of Sociology/Anthropology, Kirtipur Multiple Campus, T.U. He obtained his doctoral degree from the University of Delhi in the year 1999 in Anthropology discipline. His doctoral topic had been "People-centered development in Nepal: An innovative Approach". Dr. Devkota secured his Masters degree from Puna University, India as back as in 1980. He did his diploma in Education from Tribhuvan University in 1973.

Dr. Devkota's professional areas of interests, among others, are People-centered Innovative development in Nepal; Participatory Communication in Strengthening Grassroots-up Development in Nepal and Indigenous knowledge systems and Micro-level Development for the rural areas in Nepal.

Dr. Devkota by now has served various organizations in various capacities. To name a few were Lecturer at the T.U; Development consultant SFDP/DDP-GTZ supported Dhading Development Project; SEARCH/USAID sponsored Women, Development and Democracy project; visiting professor, University of Calgary. Alberta, Canada in 1992 and as a Resource person, Village levels community development planning, Karnali-Bheri integrated rural development project, Nepal that was funded by CIDA. He also served as consultant for CERID/MOE Initiated Girl's education incentive in Nepal during 1999.

Dr. Devkota possesses tremendous experiences in research works. He has been to fields and has the distinction of being there for ten years plus.

He has several books to his credit. Some of the books he has co-authored with his professional colleagues. Dr. Devkota has attended scores of national and international level seminars. Currently he is affiliated with various academic organizations. Dr. Devkota is fluent in Nepali, English, Hindi and indegenous ethnic Nepali dialects.

Last week, we approached this versatile scholar for a chat. Dr. Devkota honored our request. Below the results -Chief editor.

TGQ1: As an expert on people-centered development, how, you Dr. Devkota, assess Nepal's development policies underway? By the measure of classical political economy where do they stand? With the people or with the capital? Your exclusive comments please!

Dr. Devkota: At the outset, let me give few minutes to say something about people centered development. In simple terms, people-centered development means the process of development initiated on controlled and managed by the people for the people and to the people. People in the process, remain active agents, agencies and beneficiaries of development programs and projects. This also implies that it is not the development of things rather the development of human potential through self-education, action and reflection.

In the light of what I just said above, when we look Nepal's development plans, policies, strategies and actions instead of being people-centered, they are state-centered, prime minister centered, minister centered, MP centered, bureaucrat centered and political parties' centered.

The top-down approach of state-centered development framework is characterized with its several unique features such as mechanistic, deterministic, paternalistic and feudo-bureaucratic. This can never be termed as people-centered development model because it is subsequently failed to address even the minimal levels of needs, priorities and other concerns of the poor and marginalized people living for centuries in the thousands of physically, socially, economically, politically and psychologically isolated village communities across the nation. Even after the implementation of ninth-five year plans, the quality of life of the poor people have not improved. Instead, they have been pushed away inch by inch from their own familiar work and life in the name of so-called delivery-oriented types of developmental policies, strategies and actions. The poor and the power-less in this way have been further marginalized in all walks of their life, as a consequence of defective state-centric type of development framework imposed by the powerful group of planners and politicians from above to the weak, fragile and power-less people living down below the ground level. These people have been too much disturbed by the many development plans and programs. As a consequence, they have been frustrated and kinds of new culture namely the culture of frustration, cynicism and silence has emerged specially at the grass-root levels. The underlying vision is that all-developmental policy, strategies and actions have been created and projected to maintain the existing power structure and status quo of the ruling elites. The end result is that these developmental policies and strategies have failed to deliver goods and services to the most needy section of economically vulnerable population. The present state-centric model of development thus lacks a clear-cut vision and commitments bringing development more closer to the ways of life of the poorest of the poor. Above all, all development policies and programs in Nepal have remained political-friendly, bureaucrat-friendly, planner-friendly instead of being people-friendly. This can never address the burning problems of poor, weak, deprived and marginalized people living in the remote village communities across the length and breadth of the nation.

TGQ2: Why development processes of Nepal have failed to become people-centered? Because of comprador nature of the governing class, weak base of industrial capitalism or just exploitation by outside centers? In other words, why Nepal did not become successful in breaking the barriers for development. Whom you blame any way?

Dr. Devkota: There are several reasons when taken together in a bunch led to the failure of many people-oriented developmental policies, programs and projects in Nepal. Many of these look good only on paper. In actual practice they doomed to fail to address the most pressing needs of the poor and the marginalized people. Why is this happening? Most crucial aspect is the lack of commitment, sincerity and honesty on the part of planners and politicians who claim themselves as the sole agents for national development. The widespread culture of corruption, tradition of nepotism and values of sycophancy are the main reasons behind being the development policies and programs ineffective and unsustainable. As we all know, a large stock of financial resources have been illegally diverted to meet the vested interests of the country's political elites. Everybody knows that dozens of yesterday's street boys have been turned into millionaire in the name of democracy and politics. No body knows, in what way and how much money they succeeded to make within a very short span of time. Even the Prime minister remains helpless to take necessary actions against those people because they run the system of which the Prime minister is the integral part. When the head of government can't do any thing against the corrupt people what can we expect from the intellectuals and general public? Nothing more nothing less. Furthermore no Prime ministers' in Nepal deserve such courage to take anti-corruption actions against their own patron-kings covered with the blankets of political ideologies. I see no way to check the prevailing culture of corruption, nepotism and favoritism. I'm pessimistic and cynical to suggest any alternative measures to check the culture of corruption. It is taken a well-accepted shape of national culture.

On the other hand, the overall quality of life of the poor people is deteriorating day by day. A newly delivered woman does not even get a hot plate of rice to eat in many villages of Nepal. Do the women welfare minister knows where the flow of foreign aid has gone or who have been most benefited by it? The state has to keep and maintain many white elephants. They are never satisfied of making money and leading a luxurious life. This practice is live and continuing before our eyes.

Traditionally, Nepalese people are blanketed with the receptive type of culture. If the corrupt people will come on the public platform and declare their illegally earned property in the condition that half of it will be kept by them and the rest half will be given to the development of the poorest of the poor people. The general public will give their humble claps in favor of such a self-declared corrupt person. Is there someone who is willing to do this in the name of democracy and development of the poor subjects. None. If so then why our politicians are wasting their time in teaching us the lesson of political ethics and political culture.

To tell you the truth, whatever money, material and goods are allotted in the name of development have been misdirected, misused and mishandled by the so-called political elites of national, district and local levels. I see them as the major barriers in the direction of enhancing authentic people-centered development in the country. Truly speaking, they are the development leaches, BIKASE JUKA of this country. They absorb a huge amount of resources living very little to do the development for the general public.

In recent years, some new programs have also appeared in the development scenario of the country. These include "build our village ourselves", rural self-reliant program, Ganeshman peace program and finally BP with the poor. We can't expect much from all these programs because the feudo-bureaucratic framework under which these programs are supposed to be run is weak, traditional, fragile and corrupt. Whatever good things we innovate, when it is put into a corrupt system it becomes ineffective, defective and dys-functional.

TGQ3: Critics of development say that "in the name of development" there is destruction of nature, culture and life-world of people and the subsequent emulation of modernity produced its opposite "Failed development." If Nepal represents the case of failed development why the same politicians, planners and policy-makers are still dominating the scene? Should not they be brought to court trials and new thinking should be encouraged? Or, do you think that the mainstream donors' paternalistic attitudes towards them leave no option for the Nepalese people to organize the society and the state in a better way?

Dr.Devkota: I'm not much worried about the excessive depletion of natural resources ongoing in Nepal. These can be generated and regenerated even in the emergent future. I'm much worried about the excessive depletion of all-national identities, good-old ways, proper characters and feeling of nationalism and national integrity. Now we do not have love to our own nation. If free visa is provided, every Nepali would like to become a American, Japanese, Australian or an European. A major landslide is going on in our moral character. We have forgotten the life history of Bhimsen Thapa, Amar Singh Thapa, Balbhadra Kunwar and Bhakti Thapa. Our new role models have been the most corrupt persons of the country. We are swimming in a pond which id full of corrupt germs. How long can we survive in this way. This is a very unfortunate situation emerging in the country. On the other hand, a major landslide is taking place in our cultural values and norms. The good-conducts and practices aimed in promoting the welfare of one and all are being replaced with the new values of self-promotion and protection. When the basics of society are eroded. You can't expect for a type of development that is based on the alien society and culture. It is like fixing and foreign-key in our own lock that has just a reverse profile. After all, it does not work.

So far the question of foreign aid is concerned, it will come to Nepal even if we do not ask for it. It is a global process and will continue to happen at the global level. It is an imposed affair and we can't stop it. In recent years, HMG has initiated a policy under which every development program must go through the existing system. Now, this policy has dominated the development scene of the country. But the system is pro-state oriented and corrupt. When foreign aided projects are channeled into such a system this means that they are providing fuel to strengthen a worst system. This also implies that all foreign aided projects are indirectly helping to domesticate general public in favor of a most corrupt development system primarily patronized by the state.

TGQ4: What measures would you suggest to rectify the current problem of the 'development of underdevelopment' in the country? And why do you consider them realistic and contextual options? Your comments please.

Dr. Devkota: Development is a phenomena directly connected with the nuts and bolts of existing power structure. In the context of Nepal, development has been mainly an state affair. People are considered as the mere recipients of program benefits in the form of gifts given by the planners and politicians. The ultimate goal of this kind of developmental approach is to domesticate people to meet the vested interests of political leaders. Since the masses of poor people are economically less advanced and less educated, they can't very easily break the unjust system. However, they have a full realization that the present system of development is unable to respond their genuine concerns and priorities very effectively. As a result, they feel roasted in the oven of poverty and deprivation. When the poor people attempt to speak against the unequal development, using several means silenced are their voices. The posterior of old Panchayati Mandale Tantra has now appeared with a new name and a new dress. This Tantra is guided, supported and mobilized by the influential ministers and politicians to suppress the genuine voices of the poor people.

The people who hold non-democratic norms and values with them have misused democracy in the country. It is like the coconut in the hands of a monkey. Neither it wishes to throw nor it can break its skin and take the real taste of the fruit. To be very frank, democracy has helped only to the rich, powerful and influential people. For the poor and powerless, it is either a dream-cracy or demon-cracy.

It will take some time to reverse the present power structure. I could not measure it in terms of years. I can only claim that when there is excessive corruption, widespread sycophancy and visible nepotism, people are forced to revolt against such system. All evidences suggest that the country is leading towards such a mass revolution- a total revolution aimed for achieving an authentic, clean and alternative social democracy.

TGQ5: How media can contribute to good governance in Nepal and situate the development logic to people's concerns, needs and indeed priorities?

Dr. Devkota: As we believe that media is a inevitable component in guiding development and democracy in a right track. At this juncture, it must be emphasized that media should provide fuel to the people to liberate them from the cocoons of poverty, depression and dis-empowerment. In order to make development equitable and people-centered, media should be projected to raise people's critical awareness of their own life situation. It should help people to form a critical mass that is receptive to development demands as their inborn right. In such process, the flow of knowledge and information and demand must move from all sides-upwards, downwards, sideward and also at the intermediate level. In my view, media in Nepal must be more explicit about the conscientization, empowerment, and rights to development and confidence building aspects of development communication. It is within this scenario that the challenges to the development of mass media must be enacted to liberate people from poverty, injustice, suppression and deprivation. In this way media could contribute to good governance in Nepal.

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